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My Conversation with Kevin Smith

LindaRutherford
Employee
Employee

I had the chance this afternoon to speak directly with director Kevin Smith. I let him know that in my 18 years here at Southwest, I have never dealt with a situation like what has been unfolding in the last 48 hours. I let Kevin know we have refunded his airfare. I told him we made a mistake in trying to board him as a standby passenger and then remove him. And I told him we were sorry.

 

 

Now, 48 hours later, after talking to many involved, we know there were several things going on that day and that our Employees were doing their best to get his flight out safely and on time, including finding seats for everyone and trying to accommodate standby passengers. The Captain did not single Kevin out to be removed, but he did ask that the boarding be completed quickly. At that time, our Employees made the decision to remove Kevin after a quick judgment call that he might have needed more than one seat for his comfort and those seated next to him. 

 

 

Although I’m not here to debate the decision our Employees made, I can tell you that I for one have learned a lot today. The communication among our Employees was not as sharp as it should have been and, it’s apparent that Southwest could have handled this situation differently. Thanks, Kevin, for your passion around this topic. You were a reasonable guy during our conversation.

 

 

Southwest, like most carriers, has a policy to assist passengers who need two seats onboard an aircraft. The policy is an important one for the comfort and safety of all passengers aboard a plane, and we stand by that 25-year-old policy. This has our attention, and we will be reviewing how and when this delicate policy is implemented.

1,803 Comments
Anonymous192
Explorer C
Linda, I was hoping after reading your response I would be proud of the way Southwest handled this opportunity, and YES this is an opportunity, unfortunately that is not the case. First of all the statement about never having dealt with a situation like this in 18 years is a vague and irrelevant. Is it that you have never had customer service problems in 18 years or that those problems have never been with someone who had a platform? It doesn’t instill the confidence that I, as a customer, should have in a person in your position within a company who touts customer service as what sets them apart from the competition. This situation should be handled like every customer service complaint, because every customer counts not just the famous ones. You should investigate find all the facts and post the findings and communicate how Southwest is a better company for it. As for the opportunity at hand, it is obvious to me after reading the tweets and listening to the “SMODCAST” that Mr. Smith was not handled per company policy. As much as the Lawyers frown upon admitting guilt that is exactly what must be done. I love Southwest but when you screw up, you have to own up to it. If I was trying to get to the bottom of this…and you should be, I would start with the employee who asked Mr. Smith if he was a nonrevenue passenger. This employee was probably flying fourth jump seat and thought he had a seat until Mr. Smith arrived. At no point should any employee on the plane ever ask if a passenger is nonrevenue. Once they hit the jet way all customers should be treated as revenue passengers, that information is taken care of at the gate counter and should have no bearing once being ticketed. That employee is the probably the root of this whole situation and should be identified and reprimanded along with the gate agent. These types of customer service infractions cannot go unchecked or they will spiral out of control. Southwest must once again reinforce its foundation as a company built on customer service. It doesn’t appear from the outside as though this really had anything to do with the policy on overweight customers. Mr. Smith was able to lower the armrests and didn’t need the extension to buckle his safety belt. That was just the excuse that was given, which has snowballed out of control. Having said this, the first thing Southwest needs to do is clearly state the policy on overweight customers, whenever addressing this issue. Mr. Smith is a very intelligent person and has a very loyal following you should invite him to Dallas to sit down and address how the policy is implemented and how it could be improved as not to embarrass or demean anyone. The policy is in place for a reason but the way it is being implemented is wrong and can be done better. This is a great opportunity for Southwest to show the world how important Customer Service is to the Southwest culture and that every customer counts!
Anonymous3242
Explorer C
Oh, for goodness' sake. Even if a Southwest employee or two handled this situation imperfectly, that's no reason to call for a boycott or to take your business elsewhere. Employees of large corporations make customer-relations mistakes and errors in judgment all the time; so long as the company apologies and makes amends (which is what happened here), there's no need to call for anyone's head on a platter. Somehow one less than optimal experience causes everyone to discount the hundreds of satisfactory customer-service experience they've had. A little perspective, people.
Anonymous2121
Explorer C
Wow. I'm not a huge fan of Kevin Smith, but after reading this, I guess I have to say that free bags or not, I'll never fly Southwest - because if you have a policy that employees can fall back on to discriminate on people based on a perception, then what's next? Color? Odor? A general uneasy feeling? What about someone who is skinny but wears large, flowing, voluminous clothing? What about someone who hasn't showered in four days? What about someone who bought two seats just because he's more comfortable that way, and then you figure "well, he'll get us some free publicity..." I won't be using your airline any further. And I'll be recommending that no one I know use you, either, because of these "policies" you can arbitrarily "invoke" because you feel like it. Not that anyone's going to read my comments, but I'm glad I've gotten this off my chest.
Anonymous466
Explorer C
Fat people are the reason health care is so expensive, they shouldnt be allowed to fly, make them run to their destination.
Fly_the_Sky
Explorer C
-First of all, with all the money Kevin has, why the F*** is he flying the cheapest airline? Shouldn't he have his own jet or something? -Secondly, Look at the guy in a RECENT photo. There is no way he could fit in a regular seat with the armrests down, still be able to buckle and unbuckle the belt, and open the arms without encrotching on another passenger's seat. The armrests were not made to be used as GIRDLES! (MY backside barely fits comfortably in a COACH class seat by the way, and I do not consider myself large. Were all these people saying Kevin actually FIT in the seat actually THERE, or just believing his angry spouting?) -Thirdly, anyone that believes every word coming out of "Silent Bobs" mouth as gospel must be smoking the same stuff he is, and eating the same number of twinkies when he gets the munchies. He is/was angry and now he is venting on Twitter because he is a hot head. What does he expect to get out of this? Money? A bigger seat? A free week's worth of Weight Watcher's food? -Fourth, anyone on here saying they are not going to use Southwest anymore due to mr. smith's outrage is a complete liar. Southwest has some of the best prices for airfare around, no charge for baggage, and the most polite staff I have had the pleasure to fly with. If Kevin is cheap enough to be flying Southwest regularly, he is not going to want to pay a few hundred dollars more to use another airline, and neither will any of the other idiots claiming that they will not fly Southwest.
Redmond_Herring
Explorer C
I think the comment by Kevin Mon 15 Feb 18:58 is highly meritorious - have a commando course at check in, and those who pass the course may board. If SWA is serious about no overcrowding on board, perhaps it could be the 1st US airline to enforce REASONABLE carry-on baggage limits. I have seen people drag sea trunks on as carry-on (albeit, I refer to other US airlines, not SWA). Most non-US airlines are very strict about weight (usually around 7kg) and mass limits for carry-on. There are a lot of comments on this blog about overweight people (albeit not from SWA writers). This is a wee bit rich in a nation where so many people are overweight. Cheers!
Big_John
Explorer C
If anything, as a person of size, this has alerted me to the fact that I'm wasting a ton of money flying first class on other airlines when I could just buy up a whole row on SWA. I didn't even think of that. Would they let me put my feet up on the other seats? What if I have my belt buckled? Can I buy all the seats around me? How much for the whole plane? (this could really beat out private jets) I fly to Austin every October: for 137 seats, $300 R/T, that's only $41k - that's not bad!
Anonymous2002
Explorer C
I know that, as I am now, I will never be kicked off of a flight based on my weight. That being said, I am appalled by this story. This apology does not come across as sincere, but rather a PR stunt to try and make the company look better. There certainly are individuals who cannot fit into their seats or buckle up properly. However, if he is capable of doing so, there really is no reason for this inappropriate action. In my university, I regularly have to sit in lecture halls in small seats crammed up against the people next to me. People of average body size still encroach into my space - knees touch, elbows get in the way. Yes, its uncomfortable at times. But if this is acceptable in our nation's highest institutions of learning and self-improvement, why does everyone make such a huge fit about it for low-cost short-flight air travel?
A_Hawaiian_that
Explorer C
This was written by Howard Dikus in HawaiI I dare you to post it! Winston Churchill insulted a lady at a party, telling her she was ugly. She informed him he was drunk. “That may be, madam,” the British prime minister allegedly replied, “but tomorrow I shall be sober.” It is true that someone who is drunk today may be sober tomorrow, but it is also the case that someone who is fat today may have been slim yesterday. And this is one reason why fat people resent being told they are too fat to fly. They have no trouble recalling when they were not yet overweight but still found airplane seats uncomfortable. My own figure, which these days recalls Raymond Burr somewhere between “Ironsides” and “The Return of Perry Mason,” is wide for coach for the same reason that it was wide for coach two decades ago when I was slim: my shoulders are too wide. Yet I have normal shoulders for a man of 5′10″. I think of this whenever I fly coach, as was the case Sunday on Hawaiian Airlines Flight 9 from LAX to HNL. On this flight, which featured the best-looking flight attendant crew I have ever had the pleasure to accept a Diet Coke from, my seat was uncomfortable even though the passenger in the next seat was a petite blonde who took up less than her share of the space. Like everyone else, of course, I am used to it, and understand the economics of the situation, which can be blamed partly on the oil industry and partly on ourselves for the commoditization of air fare, but not so much on the airline itself and not at all on the employees working the flight. My own pleasant flight happened over the same weekend that a Southwest Airlines pilot ejected film director Kevin Smith from a flight on the grounds that he was too fat, even though Smith, too, is insufficiently corpulent to require a seat belt extender and the airline has not denied that there were larger passengers not ejected. Kevin Smith, 39, is the director of the movies “Clerks,” “Mallrats,” “Chasing Amy,” “Dogma,” “Jay and Silent Bob Strike Back,” “Jersey Girl,” and “Zack and Miri Make a Porno,” and plays the character Silent Bob in six of these films. The new movie “Cop Out” with Bruce Willis and Tracy Morgan is the first film Smith has directed without having also written the screenplay. On the evidence of online photos Smith may be a little bigger than he was as Silent Bob but he still appears to be on the smallish side as expansive directors go. Smith challenged Southwest to bring some of its seats onto a television show and he would demonstrate his ability to fit in them. Southwest has declined the challenge. Southwest initially took what struck some as a somewhat snotty view of the matter but has retrenched slightly after finding that Smith, who is frank about his fatness without asserting any special rights, strikes a chord with other passengers including non-fat ones. Of course he does. Airline seats feel narrow to most slim passengers, too, because their shoulders are wider than the seats. The failure of Southwest to pick up on that suggests a certain fataphobia at the airline, but that’s not my problem, since they don’t fly to Hawaii. Hawaiian Airlines, by contrast, embraces the size variety of Hawaii residents and visitors and warmly welcomes all comers. On my flight there was a big couple a few seats in front of me. She was perhaps 270; he was well north of 400; but they managed to squeeze into their seats and squeezed and hugged each other all through the flight. They turned their close quarters into an hours-long embrace and it warmed my heart to see it. And when they wake up tomorrow they’ll still be lovebirds and Southwest Airlines will still be a laughingstock.
Derrick_Shepard
Explorer C
"Thanks, I've sat next to seem really fat people on airlines. I appreciate you enforcing this for us all! If anything, I think most people should be required to run a mile in under 15 minutes to fly southwest. Can we get this imposed?" Rick — Mon, 02/15/2010 - 18:58 How about an I.Q. test Rick? I mean, after all, we wouldn't want your stupidity flowing over onto the other passengers. What do you say, 130 or no fly?
Anonymous1633
Explorer C
After reading these posts, I think that can see the point Kevin was trying to make in his most recent blog post http://silentbobspeaks.com/?p=393 He says that Linda admits to him that he was not thrown off the plane because of his size, but rather because of some mix up that was no fault of his own. All he wanted was SouthWest to publicly admit this, and so Linda posts this blog but keeps the part at the bottom about the policy overweight people need to buy 2 seats, which is really still insinuating that he was thrown off because he was fat. Now I read all the posts here and it seems the general population is still under the impression that he was thrown off because he was fat. HE WAS NOT THROWN OFF THE PLANE BECAUSE HE WAS FAT!! LINDA, YOU REALLY SHOULD POST A BETTER APOLOGY!
Anonymous216
Explorer C
Wow, you guys continue to tell lies and slur Kevin's name just to suit your agenda. Your airline is crap anyways, you actually pushed people out of the line to accomodate the Mayor of San Francisco's wife, and well, your planes are smelly. I'd wish something bad to happen to your airline, but you seem to be so slipshod, you're doing just fine screwing up. Die, please!
WilliamW
Explorer C
This is your idea of making things better Southwest? I am suppose to feel better about flying your airline now? If you feel that it is okay for a gate attendant to publicly embarrass customers by lying to them about who is removing them from the plane while also lying about why they are being removed from a plane just to avoid the embarrassment of saying "Sorry sir we were wrong about this being a free seat after all." how is that suppose to make me feel good about your airline??? You may love bags, but apparently you have absolutely no respect for the owners of those bags, your paying customers. Shame on you Southwest, you have lost yet another customer. (This is my second attempt at publishing this comment, we will see if it works this time.)
Dave18
Explorer C
Your requirements for a single seat occupant is that a person be able to put the arm rests down on both sides. Not only could Kevin Smith do this, but he could also buckle his seatbelt without needing an extension. So why are you still retreading this "people of size require two seats" garbage? IT WAS NOT APPLICABLE to Kevin Smith! It is COMPLETELY IRRELEVANT. He was within your requirements, and you still kicked him off the plane. This is categorically absurd. You can't establish standards and requirements and then follow them arbitrarily. You stick to the requirements you've set so that situations like this are avoided. And when you DO screw up, you come clean... you don't continue to use irrelevant distractions to keep beating the guy down. HE did nothing wrong. HE conformed to the standards YOU set and is being punished for doing so. I flew 145,000 miles last year. I'm a priority flier at three different airlines. In the many years I've been flying, I have never seen such blatant disrespect for a passenger as what Kevin Smith was put through by Southwest. Probably because I've never flown your airline.
Anonymous3429
Explorer C
I've sat in between two men, who were not overweight, and who crushed me into my seat on both sides because they spread their legs as wide as possible. Why don't you make them buy two seats, too? And to the person who said they didn't want to be stuck climbing over a fat person-- I'm sorry, but unless it's a child, there is no way to NOT climb over a person on a standard coach flight. Any adult with legs is going to be difficult to get by, and in an emergency-- since when is it okay to push and climb over someone? Are you more important than they are? Do you have a right to get to the exit before they do?
Markas
Explorer C
Oh give me a break! If you're fat and too large to fit in a seat without imposing on the person next to you then buy a second seat! I am 6' 2" and 225lbs, I'm not fat but I use every bit of my seat and I can't tell you how many times I've had a "large" person stuffed into the seat next to me and I have to spend hours having this person pressed up against me. Sorry but I don't appreciate it! I paid for my seat, the whole thing, not part of it, and I don't feel I should have to share it with you because you are too large to fit within the confines of your seat. YOU need to do what's right and buy another seat for yourself, fly first class or drive your car! Southwest - kudo's to you for enforcing your policy!
Steven_Gerhart
Explorer C
What about the fact that Kevin just flew southwest in a single seat, with no issue right before this flight? Or the fact that he was fastened in his seat, without an extender, and demonstrated that both arm rests could be put down comfortably for both him, and his fellow passengers? I believe the employees we're abusing their power, and publicly humiliated a paying customer. I don't believe it would make the situation easier for Kevin being a celebrity, it would make it worse, sitting there thinking that the whole world will know about his very public, degradation. I think what happened to both Kevin, and another female passenger on his next flight, is abhorrent, disgusting, and extremely discriminating. I believe southwest (purposely left uncapitalized) did a piss-poor job apologizing for their actions, and are extremely lucky that Kevin doesn't take legal action against the airline. After reading the above statement, I implore Kevin, and others who share similar experiences to come forward on the heels of Kevin's courage, and to take legal action against the airline. As Americans, we have to stand up to injustice, no matter what the cost, to defend our freedoms... It's what this country was founded on.
Former_Southwes11
Explorer C
Where's the apology? The original post claimed they booted Kevin Smith because he didn't fit in the seat. Nowhere does SWA take that back, even after people have spoken up and said he DID fit in the seat, and he's gone on TV and proved he fits in the seat fine. All I see is, "well, we shouldn't have sat him but we have a weight policy". That doesn't say, "We made a mistake because he fit in the seat just fine". The employees decided he might need another seat to be comfortable? I'm 5', 108 pounds, and have been on flights where an additional seat would have made me more comfortable. Sorry, airlines, but you've got us packed in so tightly that even *I* can barely move when they guy in front of me puts his seat back, and the "armrests" wouldn't fit my elbow. You have a policy that passengers need to fit inside their armrests, fine - it's good, should be stuck to, and should only be mentioned in your apology if followed by the sentence, "Mr. Smith met these requirements and we were wrong to pull him". A policy of "our employees will decide who's making the flight" is what your policy really seems to be, though.
Anonymous234
Explorer C
What a half-hearted apology Southwest. Shame on you.
Anonymous3328
Explorer C
Interesting how those claiming to be "normal sized" feel that SWA have the right to kick whomever they feel like off their flights for being "a customer of size". It seems like the world has forgotten that not to long ago SWA was ridiculed for booting a customer off the flight for dressing in a fashion they deemed "inappropriately". If a person, like the amazing Kevin Smith, can fit in the seat, buckle the buckle and put down the arm rests, leave them be. There is no reason to single them out and remove them from the flight. And trying to walk around the excuses and change your minds and statements about why you did so is disgusting. Just be real - you took him off the flight because you deemed him "too fat to fly" when he flies your airline all the time and has never had a problem before. SWA is only a step away from deciding who can and can't fly based on hair color, eye color, whether or not they are Christian or Jewish or Mormons, or whether or not they are wearing green, the color of the day. It's just disgusting.
Fin
Explorer C
I know this is delicate subject. I can't blame Southwest for what they have done and obviously Kevin Smith is humiliated. Although I think he went too far with all the name calling and swearing. It's very obvious with his reaction that his weight is and has been a personal issue. He said he buys two seats because he can and southwest is the welfare airline. Well I'm sure other people with his star power and his money who weigh less than 200 lbs don't consider buying two seats. Probably doesn't even cross their mind. He has an issue with his weight and he's embarrassed by the fact that it was made so public. Naturally who wouldn't but like I said he took it too far. If he looked at all his action figures and cartoon images he would notice that they represent a person who is severly obese regardless of how baggy his clothes are. If he doesn't think so then perhaps he needs to ask his doctor or look the word up. Also just because a person can get the armrest down and the seatbelt on doesn't mean they all should be able to fly at any time. I've seen MANY overweight people squeeze into airplane seats as well as office chairs, restaurant chairs, etc. Just because the butt can fit or the armrest comes down doesn't mean that seat was meant for that person. If 200 Kevin Smith's boarded the same plane the plane wouldn't be able to take off much less they wouldn't be comfortable. The airlines reserve the right to remove anyone from the plane that they deem overweight. If a person is overweight then they should buy an extra seat, or fly on an airline that has first class. Don't get upset at people who spend the same amount of money but their space is invaded. Kevin Smith knows this otherwise he wouldn't buy two seats when he flies. So that goes back to this not being a Southwest issue. It's really a Kevin Smith issue. And yes I have gone to Kevin Smith's website and read his entire side of the story. It's still his issue.
Anonymous3624
Explorer C
I feel Kevin Smith is making an issue of this for the media attention. I am stunned at the number of people who think Southwest handled this wrong. If he had 2 seats on another flight and chose to try to go on standby but 2 seats were not available, where is the problem? Southwest is at fault here? He is making an issue out of being FAT. I personally love Southwest. Is there any other airline that does not charge for bags - forcing people to carry everthing on the plane? On my last Delta flight it was 35 minutes late taking off because of the nightmare trying to get all the luggage stored in the overhead bins. How about no fees for changing flight schedules - or cancelling flights? A US Air flight last week that I had to cancel because of the blizzard cost me $150 - even with their "weather policy" rules. Flying, in general, is not a good experience. Southwest makes it more bearable than any other airline I fly. I only wish they went to all the cities I travel to. .
magnoliafan
Explorer C
Really, SWA? Really? "You are now free to move about the country....er..except you, sir." http://silentbobspeaks.com
Anonymous1174
Explorer C
The way I see it is that all the angry people are probably obese/fat. So If you want to stay away from SW Airlines so be it! Let the Normal and thin people only have to deal with screaming kids at worst instead of both.
BJ
Explorer C
Your policy needs to be applied consistantly I have seen many people as large as Kevin and larger on flights without so much as a batted eyelash. This blog is a lot of circular talk with no admission of whether or not Kevin was too fat to fly in a single seat. If he was improperly ejected he deserves more than a refund, he deserves the record set straight. My suggestion to all airlines is to set a policy based on weight and have people weighted going through security weighed as they step through the metal detector. Anyone 300 or more should be sent to a special lane to sit in a test seat and cleared by security as allowable for single seat or required to purchase a second. Leaving it up to entry level airline desk people is insane, if Kevin was ejected for his size I am betting a half dozen others on the plane should have been as well.
BJ
Explorer C
Your policy needs to be applied consistantly I have seen many people as large as Kevin and larger on flights without so much as a batted eyelash. This blog is a lot of circular talk with no admission of whether or not Kevin was too fat to fly in a single seat. If he was improperly ejected he deserves more than a refund, he deserves the record set straight. My suggestion to all airlines is to set a policy based on weight and have people weighted going through security weighed as they step through the metal detector. Anyone 300 or more should be sent to a special lane to sit in a test seat and cleared by security as allowable for single seat or required to purchase a second. Leaving it up to entry level airline desk people is insane, if Kevin was ejected for his size I am betting a half dozen others on the plane should have been as well.
WilliamW
Explorer C
This is your idea of making things better Southwest? I am suppose to feel better about flying your airline now? If you feel that it is okay for a gate attendant to publicly embarrass customers by lying to them about who is removing them from the plane while also lying about why they are being removed from a plane just to avoid the embarrassment of saying "Sorry sir we were wrong about this being a free seat after all." how is that suppose to make me feel good about your airline??? You may love bags, but apparently you have absolutely no respect for the owners of those bags, your paying customers. Shame on you Southwest, you have lost yet another customer.
Anonymous1516
Explorer C
For all you saying that Southwest refunded & seated him in a next flight. You even know the whole story. First, they didn't refund him anything until today & the flight he took was his original flight. As it is, it's not about the refund, it's about having the decency to acknowledge when they acted wrongly. HE CAN FIT IN A DAMN SEAT. HE IS NOT THAT BIG. He's not there yet. He even says it, he can afford the extra seats because they are cheap compared to other airlines. He gets extra seats if he wants the commodity of not having to talk to other passengers if he doesn't want to, he even buys a row when he travels with his wife so they can lay on each others laps if they want to. The issue is not that, the issue is them pulling him off when he CAN FIT. He just wanted to go home, like everyone else & go on with his evening. This fuckers not only didn't let him do that, they humiliated him and then blamed HIM. Fucking assholes. Another thing, where do you get off giving confidential information about your costumer Southwest Airlines? He hadn't posted his smodcast & you were already reporting he "usually" bought 2 tickets. Which is interesting on itself because usually is NOT always and that means he has traveled before in one seat, right? So then, he can't have been a safety hazard if you have permitted him to travel in one seat before. Or are you that reckless Southwest? Do you not care about peoples safety then? Go tell your lies to people that don't see through this shit!
Anonymous2883
Explorer C
I fly a lot, when I do I like to think I'm safe with people that care about me and my safety and comfort, obviously SWA isn't what I'm looking for, you won't accept you're wrong, you're being outright offensive to a person just because of his size and you're hanging him in front of everyone. I will never fly with you again, your pathetic insults and you're jurassic rules are to blame.
Anonymous2132
Explorer C
This whole debacle that Southwest Air has caused will direct my business away from this airline.
Mike_Thornton
Explorer C
The truly sad thing about this is that Smith is the only person that SW has done this to who has had a voice. A voice people listen to. Anytime else this happens, the airline will eject people with impunity, and face no reprisal. If someone stands up to them, Air Marshals with guns forcibly remove them. After they've done the deed, the airlines that practice this discrimination rely upon the shame and humiliation to silence the people they do this to. Sadly, it looks like Smith gave up the fight. Towards the end, all Smith wanted was to save that tiny bit of face. He didn't want to be Too Fat To Fly. And all he got was spin doctors. If this happened in the business I'm in, it wouldn't take all the power and fame of a Hollywood director to have managers and owners publicly abasing themselves and canning the putzes who made the call. If it was a regular customer who frequently makes use of our services, they would receive much butt kissery, freebies, apologies and a refund on their purchase. There wouldn't be a Blog/Twitter/PR war because we would be too busy doing our best to make sure the customer felt vindicated. We would admit our mistakes. Kevin Smith -- Rosa Parks of fat people. Yeah, lots of white people didn't like it when she got uppity. But lots of us are glad she didn't get up. I wonder if the Montgomery Busses had their segregation policy in place for 25 years.
Mari2
Explorer C
All of the people saying that SWA is right and they appreciate the fact that "people of size" are being embarrassed and that the seat that they pay for are being protected - I would like to know why it's OK for people who are NOT larger than normal to encroach on my seat by hogging the armrests and fall asleep leaning towards me or spread their legs so far apart that i have to crunch my knees in to avoid them... If safety and mobility in case of an emergency is so important, why are old and infirm people allowed on planes at all? The old lady with a cane who is between me and the exit is most DEFINITELY going to impede my ability to move quickly and safely off the plane in case of an emergency. And if we are going to talk about my comfort as a passenger who has paid for her seat, then small, unruly children need to be kept off the plane as well. People who smell bad or are sick also need to be prevented from flying. Sitting trapped in a big metal tube with re-circulated air while the person next to me smells like they haven't bathed in a month or conversely smells like they have bathed in cologne or perfume is NOT comfortable. Watching as the sniffling/sneezing/coughing/hacking passenger takes the middle seat and proceeds to stuff their filthy tissues into the seat pocket in front of them and then touches our shared armrest is not safe or comfortable. And having a child kick the back of my seat and yank on their tray table as I am trying to sleep is not something I would call comfortable. So, if those are the reasons that "people of size" are kept off of planes, I want to make sure that the following people are kept off as well: * Old people * Handicapped people * Sick people * Children * Long-legged people * Those unwilling to bathe or who wear too much scent If you fall into any of those categories - STAY OFF THE AIRPLANES!!!!
Anonymous3570
Explorer C
I have always loved flying on SW and have always found your attendants to be friendly and helpful in the past. This whole incident, however, is very shocking to me and making me reconsider using you in the future. The no fees for bags thing, genius. But why would I pick you over other carriers when I or one of my travel mates just have to buy an extra seat, shelling out the money they thought they were saving, and then possibly be humiliated by the attendants or other seatmates just before we take off? Every customer deserves dignity. I fly several times a year and have since I was a baby; I have sat next to people of all sizes, abilities, ages, races, and yes levels of respect for their fellow seat mates. Being thin does not equate to being a desirable seatmate; trust me, I know. (I say all this as a very tall woman who can buckle her seat and put the arm rests down, thanks. But if the person puts their seat back in front of me, my knees cry the whole flight. But guess what? I am just getting from point A to point B; I put up with being treated like cattle for the convenience of flying. But maybe it's not a convenience any more, knowing people will be treated this way?) The people falling all over the "safety" issue to excuse their bigotry of fat people, please stop. You sound ridiculous. A lot of overweight people are actually very strong; I have a good friend who weighs over 300 lbs, but she works on a farm and is lifting hay bales equal to her weight all day. She is very agile; when we go hiking it's like watching a mountain goat skip up the hills. In an emergency, she would not only be able to get the plane doors open no prob but also CARRY people to safety if need be. Trust me, you WANT her on your flight and in your row if crap goes down. Stop judging people based on size. If you kicked Smith off because he was on standby and you needed the seat, fine. But to single him out after he boarded and claim it was because he was too fat, and then not publicly retract this after the fact? Shame on you, SW.
Anonymous2287
Explorer C
It's about time overweight people are dealt with. It's unfair to me if I have to sit next to an overweight person. They slop over into my seat, take up the arm rest forcing me to use only part of a seat I fully paid for. They are a danger to every person on the plane. If they take the aisle seat in case of an emergency how can I get by them. Once they are in the aisle they block it and no one can get around them. They also move much slower than other passengers thus preventing others from exiting quickly. I'm happy you have taken action. An overweight person shouldn't be rewarded with a voucher, cash or special seating instead they need to pay for the 2 seats that they require and not make me miserable in my seat or endanger my life. I love you Southwest and will always fly with you.
lazygirl50
Explorer C
Thank you Southwest. You have reinforced my commitment to fly SW whenever possible. I'm sure being overweight is not easy to live with. And there is no easy/right way for airlines to handle this problem. But dealing with the problem has got to start somewhere. I've never heard of Kevin Smith and if he is using his obesity to be funny then I don't want to hear of him. Obesity is NOT FUNNY. The more obstacles obese people start encountering, the sooner they'll think twice about shoving crap food down their kids throats. Most people are not born obese. Most are taught to be that way. Thank you SW for taking a stand.
orenthal_Jay
Explorer C
Southwest is a ghetto airline to begin with, so it's not surprising its employees are corporate douchebags. Love how you capitalize "Employee" like they're important when in fact they are minimum wage drones. If you were any good at what you do, you'd work at a better airline, not one that reeks of lies and feces.
Anonymous1673
Explorer C
You said you talked with Kevin Smith, but I didn't see any of his responses. Maybe if your employees would have listened to the other passengers when they said he was fine where he was, this wouldn't be a problem. Awful lot of bad press isn't it, and what does Kevin get? $100 voucher. The guy can wipe his butt with $100 and not even miss it. I would never fly SWA if I was given the chance to for free, as it seems your flight attendants are incompetent. Maybe she needs to take an "active listening" course or something.
Anonymous2656
Explorer C
Linda... This is a public relations disaster, and you and the rest of Southwest knows it. Instead of trying to twist and distort the situation (which might I say, you are doing poorly), why don't you guys just bite the bullet and admit that you are wrong. The pilot of the plane did not make the call to pull Kevin off, it was a desk clerk that pulled a famous iconic director off the plane for a weight criteria that he did not fit. So I just have two questions: 1. did anybody point out that the dude was freakin' Kevin Smith? 2. how much authority is given to you desk clerks... do they have the power to pull a paying customer off a plane?
Wezli333
Explorer C
For those of you who keep insisting to side with SWA on this issue, know that Smith is not upset that he was ejected for not meeting size requirements. He is upset because he FIT IN THE SEAT WITH BOTH ARMRESTS DOWN AND SEATBELT FASTENED, and was still ejected from the flight! Show me where SWA claims otherwise, and I will allow you to continue your hate-filled rants against overwieght individuals without viewing you as uninformed idiots or company plants.
accomodate_me
Explorer C
I still do not understand why an obese person has to purchase an extra ticket but if a child is under two years old it does not need a ticket. When my kids were BOTH under two, they were squirmy fellas, crying, and grabbing people stuff. Very bothersome, more so than a bit of excess person. Also is the guy that brings his home office going to have to buy an extra ticket, I would really like that, I hate having to be oh so careful when trying to get to the restroom when his office is spread out, at least with an obese person I might just land in a friendly persons soft lap! Seriously, Just be nice and don't single people out, or if you are going to, but one of those carry on luggage signs around saying if you cannot fit between these poles then you need to purchase two tickets. why not allow obese people to purchase half tickets and let them share a row? if they are only going to take up 1 1/2 seats, then it's fair!
Anonymous3411
Explorer C
Cant we all just get along?
accomodate_me
Explorer C
I still do not understand why an obese person has to purchase an extra ticket but if a child is under two years old it does not need a ticket. When my kids were BOTH under two, they were squirmy fellas, crying, and grabbing people's stuff. Very bothersome, more so than a bit of excess person. Also is the guy that brings his home office going to have to buy an extra ticket, I would really like that, I hate having to be oh so careful when trying to get to the restroom when his office is spread out, at least with an obese person I might just land in a friendly persons soft lap! Seriously, Just be nice and don't single people out, or if you are going to, but one of those carry on luggage signs around saying if you cannot fit between these poles then you need to purchase two tickets. why not allow obese people to purchase half tickets and let them share a row? if they are only going to take up 1 1/2 seats, then it's fair!
luvthesioux
Explorer C
I think Kevin Smith is the one that needs to be apologizing. I read his Twitter posts and they were extremely out of line (dropping the F-bomb repeatedly is not the way to solve a problem)! What a way to embarrass yourself! I've supported Southwest's policy ever since I found out a few years back that it existed, and applaud the airline for putting passenger safety and comfort ahead of being careful not to offend a couple people. I've been flying Southwest since I was 10 years old and that's not going to change. The airline's attentive, dependable flight crews are what makes them one of the safest out there. I LUV Southwest!
Kelly6
Explorer C
As someone who flies many, many times a year for business, I understand the instant reaction to try and smooth this over for someone with a public platform. But the ugly truth is that nearly every time I fly SouthWest (which I stopped doing for my own sanity this year) someone got kicked off for being in violation of the "space limits" or whatever you refer to them as. I'm a small female and I am still shamed to see people who can sit comfortably next to me booted by some attendant on a power trip or to accomodate some other attendant flying standby (and yes, that did actually happen to the person next to me once, hence me never flying SouthWest again). Either change your policy or enforce it fairly. They are two equally admirable options. Pretending that you were in the right until this blows over has not been proven as a valid or responsiable action by a corporation.
Ziggy
Explorer C
What about rude passengers who jab their elbows into your side during the whole flight? Or recline their seats so far that you can even use your tray table? These people cause me more discomfort and threaten my safety more than an overweight person would. When will there be policies to stop this from happening? Why can't you just admit that what you did was wrong? That is all Mr. Smith is looking for here.
Squished_flyer
Explorer C
I applaud SW for enforcing the "overweight policy. The problem SW ran into was not enforcing it BEFORE Kevin Smith got on the plane. As a frequent flyer of SW, I have been seated next to oversized passengers who "fit in the seat and got the arm rests down". Just because you get the arm rests down, doesn't mean you fit into the seat. Your fat squeezes under the arm rest and on to my seat so that your legs are touching mine. The fat from your upper body spills over the arm rest and into my seat so that your arms and shoulders take up 1/3 of my seat and I have to squinch over to the window so that our bodies are not touching. I have no problem with you being "oversized"....it's your body, do what you want with it. I do have a problem with you infringing on my space in my small airline seat, and then acting indignantly when someone "dares" to comment on it. Stop being so selfish and lying to yourself and thinking you fit into one seat. You don't.....so buy two seats and make everyone comfortable! And for the people choosing not to fly SW anymore.......GOOD.....now there will be more room for the rest of us that DO fit into the seats!!
TheDbagJournal
Explorer C
This is just another awkward move by a company that is making me worry. It's a series of reactive moves and is coming off as amateur hour - only positive is its been good fodder for my blog http://su.pr/2N3WlH - get your act together and start making thoughtful moves - bring in Edelman and get this cleaned up
LadyAnastasia
Explorer C
Somewhat disgusting that SWA is trying to sweep the problem under the proverbial rug isn't it. Also, I'm appalled by a majority of the comments that have been added... Us NORMAL People... take a look around you, more often than not the average person is closer to Kevin Smiths size than to a super models size. He Fit in the Seat. He Could Buckle the Seat Belt without any extender He Could put the arm rests down. hmmm.... which means... he fit in a normal person sized seat, right? This policy sucks ass people. Not only that, but... this sorry attempt at an apology sucks ass too!
Anonymous211
Explorer C
Sorry but as a person who was placed between two VERy large women with seat extenders from VEgas to the midwest on a packed Flight, I have to say someone had to draw the line, with Smith. If you are that large pay for 2 seats as I had no one to trade with and no room to move on the plane. I am not large by any means. I... paid for MY seat, and should ALSO be comfortable. Both ladies overflowed onto my seat. Hell I could not even read a book. I understand what soutwest did. I have been "stuck in the middle before"
Kerry1
Explorer C
Paige, you said, "those of us who fit into one seat are actually really happy to hear this policy was enforced." I say, speak for yourself! I am an average size person and though I have been uncomfortable on flights with someone who is larger than average size next to me, I DEAL WITH IT. Why? Because I'm also annoyed by crying babies, children kicking the back of my seat, people wearing cologne, perfume or perfumed lotions, people who snore, people who fall asleep on my shoulder, people with body odor, people who take off their shoes and socks and have touched me with their bare feet, people who won't SHUT UP, tall and wide men who probably have an average BMI but still take up some of my seat, and RUDE people who think that both armrests are theirs! Flying economy is only halfway enjoyable when you're lucky enough to have no one sitting next to, in front, or behind you. If any of you above average size people need someone to sit by, you can come sit by me! Just don't get annoyed when I snore!